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There are some key details concerning the Penn Station Renovation.
- The track level and train shed are to get upgrades
- It will be a single-level concourse
- The new concourse should be designed to allow daylight in
Unlike past proposals, the new requirements feature the track level. Perhaps we may see a new configuration of stairs and elevators along with reduced clutter.
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This is why we can’t have nice things.
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The idea of financing parts of the Penn Station reconstruction with revenue from new skyscrapers isn’t new. Gov. Kathy Hochul and former Gov. Andrew Cuomo both pitched different versions of the concept. But they ultimately fizzled after the company Vornado, which owns the bulk of the real estate around Penn, reported in 2022 that there wasn’t enough demand to build new office space in the area due to remote work habits that began in the COVID-19 pandemic.
But now, after the Trump administration seized control of the station’s rebuild from the MTA, the company is bullish.
On a call with investors last week, Vornado CEO Steven Roth said the company’s leases this year have skyrocketed to the highest in a decade and the second highest on record. He reported “the Penn District will be a growth engine for our company for years to come, with rising rents and future development projects.”
Roth also said Vornado planned to work with a builder on a pitch for the Penn Station rebuild.
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Sure, the feds and Trump will take over this, and then one day he’ll feel like tweeting that it’s “terminated”, as he did with the Gateway Tunnel. A show run by fools.
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Thankfully, Gateway is not “terminated” and the TBMs are still arriving soon and several key projects are underway. The feds are all back but no bite. Plus they can’t take away money that already was disbursed.
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I’m still confused over whether additional tracks will be built outside the current footprint.
Oh well, nothing’s going to happen anyway.
As Yogi Berra said, nothing is certain in life except death, taxes and the immovability of Madison Square Garden.
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This is unlikely to happen. At least for the foreseeable future.
Not sure whether to put this in NYC underground or this thread, but heres a good video on penn station through running
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Byford has recently discussed through running again and mentioned the FRA is currently studying what would have to be done to facilitate it. In addition, Byford has reiterated that a thoughtful renovation does not necessarily require moving MSG, although he left open the possibility that MSG may be relocated to whoever is chosen to design a new Penn.
Perhaps this can also be an impetus to get NJT to buy actually modern trains instead of junk that uses a design already almost 20 years out of date, expensive, and becoming vaporware.
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Interesting take, NJ Transit equipment blows away Metro North’s ancient equipment. And they are equal or superior to LIRR, especially after the Bi-level IIIs replace the last of the Arrow IIIs.
To make through running easier LIRR and Metro North need to ditch the 3rd rail catenary and conform to what NJ Transit and Amtrak run through their overhead catenary.
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That will never happen. The LIRR has been electrified with 3rd rail since the early 1900s. It will be extremely cost-prohibitive to replace all of their 3rd rail with overhead lines. And Metro North bought brand new dual-mode locomotives. Their 3rd rail isn’t going anywhere either.
The bi-level cars are terrible for the type of service that would likely be required if they are through-run. It takes forever to empty out them things at terminals and increases dwell times. If they are going to have an efficient operation, they need modern, single-level EMUs designed to reduce dwell times, especially since people are cramming into these things and NJT is known for not opening all the doors, which makes it even worse.
And the III’s won’t arrive until the next century. Those Arrow cars aren’t going anywhere anytime soon. Alstom is absolutely garbage, and NJT needs to fire them already. I’ve already mentioned elsewhere how absolutely delayed those things are (they were ordered in ~2018), and not one new car is in service or on NJT property, which is madness considering it isn’t even a new design.
I also won’t be surprised if Metro North latches onto the CTRail car order for new single-deck coaches. Those are really nice and blow anything NJT is ordering out of the water.
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What? I’ve taken NJT coming from Newark Airport into Penn station and those trains looked like they were straight out of the 1950’s lol…those trains are old and embarrassing. Can’t imagine the shock foreigners visiting the city for the first time experience. Those trains got nothing on Metro North and LIRR!
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There is no thru-running. Why waste time on something that has no support from any constituent party? It’s almost as silly and meaningless as arguing about bringing back the old Penn Station.
Again, except for special events, like at the Meadowlands, MTA and NJT have zero interest or need for thru-running.
To be honest, trains in the 1950s were extremely nice. Things started getting bad by the 70’s.
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I would argue they do have a need for through running. Adding more tracks will further complicate Penn Station and will cost billions as well. Also they don’t need to change all of the LIRR to overhead wires for it to work.
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Ancient equipment?
sometimes people say things that they pull out of their ssa and you just gotta keep pushing
Do you have details regarding availability of off-the-shelf overhead wire technology that is compatible with the tight clearances in Metro North’s Park Avenue Tunnel?
I seem to remember reading somewhere that squeezing the wires through there would not be easy with the products currently available on the market.
When the New Haven Line starts serving Pennsylvania Station a few years from now, presumably you could have some of those trains through-run to NJ Transit, as it seems all LIRR tracks except 20/21 connect to the Hudson River tunnel. However, this would require re-electrifying the wires:
The only full-length tracks that can access both the northern and southern pair of East River Tunnels are Tracks 15 and 16. Tracks 18 to 21 are accessible to Amtrak trains coming from the northern portion of the Northeast Corridor, but the overhead wire is currently nonfunctional. Today, these tracks are used exclusively by MTA LIRR. Finally, while Tracks 18 and 19 connect to the North River Tunnels, Tracks 20 and 21 do not and, thus, cannot serve Amtrak trains traveling on the southern portion of the Northeast Corridor.
